Riversdale and Chinatown
河都區與華埠：描述、連繫與經歷
Description, relationship and experience
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1.01 Kept away from Riversdale

 

Interviewer 訪問者
但係…未加入你個養生會之前嘅，咁你可能有冇嚟過 Riversdale 呢邊？
But... before you joined your wellness club, did you ever come to the Riversdale area?

 

Ms. Chow
都冇啊，冇啊。
No, no.

 

Ms. Chow
因為，嗱，講得唔係幾好聽，誒，我個仔咧，就因為見我又細粒又老啦，就唔係好想我去嗰啲雜啲咁多嘅地方。
Because, well, it doesn't sound very nice, uh, my son, because he saw I was small and old, he didn't really want me going to those rougher places.

 

Interviewer 訪問者
嗯嗯，即係個印象其實對呢度係雜。
Mm-hm, so the impression of this area was that it was rough.

 

Ms. Chow
係啦，係啦，係啦，係啦。
Yes, yes, yes, yes.

 

Ms. Chow
冇乜嘢。佢話「你去得…你等埋我先同你去啦。」
Nothing really. He said "You can go... wait for me and I'll go with you."

1.02 Walking the neighbourhood together

 

Ms. Chow
嗯…唔係好覺眼。我好少好少落嚟。所以，咁我一嚟，咁啊入嚟呢度(Juniper House)或者即係去…
Mm... I don't really notice. I come down very, very rarely. So, when I come, I come into here (Juniper House) or else I go...

 

Ms. Chow
我都唔係點喺街度行㗎啦，除咗喺，誒，White Buffalo 嗰度做個 exercise 嘅時候咧，佢哋有陣時咧，誒，出街行咧，咁我行過幾次啫。係咁。
I don't really walk around on the street, except when, uh, I'm doing exercise at White Buffalo, sometimes they, uh, go out walking, and I've walked with them a few times. That's it.

 

Ms. Chow
我都唔會注意到啲乜嘢嘅咧，因為一路行一路傾偈，係就唔會注意到乜嘢人。
I don't notice much, because you're walking and chatting at the same time, you don't notice anyone.

 

Ms. Chow
係啦。咁啊一路傾一路行咧，就唔會覺眼出邊發生啲乜嘢事啊，或者你嘅左鄰右里做乜嘢咁啫。即係你個朋友一齊行嘅時候傾偈就會有…
That's right. You talk and walk at the same time, so you don't notice what's happening around you, or what your neighbours are up to. I mean when you're walking with friends and chatting, there'd be...

1.03 Finding the area through the wellness club at Juniper House

 

Ms. Chow
放工，喺屋企，行吓街，誒，就係咁樣。即係好少。直至到幾多年前啊，誒，COVID 之前咧，咁我就 join 咗佢呢個養生會。
Finish work, stay home, stroll around, uh, that's how it was. I mean very little. Until a few years ago, uh, before COVID, I joined this wellness club of theirs.

 

Interviewer 訪問者
係，即係松柏樓嘅養生會啦？
Yes, you mean the Juniper House wellness club?

 

Ms. Chow
係喇，係喇。
That's right, that's right.

 

Ms. Chow
你講養生會？養生會係打太極咯。我最終嘅目的…睇嚟打太極，學打太極。
You're asking about the wellness club? The wellness club does tai chi. My main goal... was to come and do tai chi, to learn tai chi.

 

Interviewer 訪問者
咁除咗喺…即係…所以可唔可以話你真正啊...感受呢個地區，係因為你加入咗呢個養生會，所以先有多啲機會啊喺呢度識到啲人啊，識到啲…咩？
So apart from... I mean... so could you say that you really... got to feel this area because you joined this wellness club, so you had more chances to get to know people here, to get to know... what?

 

Ms. Chow
係，係…係。
Yes, yes... yes.

1.04 Festivals at the table

 

Ms. Chow
我哋，誒，食啦。老咗啦，唔係食啊做乜嘢？咁，食同埋做運動。[笑]
We, uh, eat. We're old, if not eat, then what else? So, eating and exercise. [laughs]

 

Ms. Chow
每個禮拜一次嘅，嗰陣時。但係食嘢就唔係成日都食，即係有啲…話新年啦，誒，中秋節啊，端午節…我哋有冇啊？即係我都唔係好記得啊。即係就係啲節日咧，就我哋就同埋一齊咧，誒，一齊食嘢咯。好似今次咁，誒，中秋節就嚟嚟啦，你嚟唔嚟啊？
Once a week, back then. But we don't eat all the time, there are certain... like New Year, uh, Mid-Autumn Festival, Dragon Boat Festival... do we have that? I don't really remember. I mean on festivals, we get together, uh, and eat together. Like this time, uh, Mid-Autumn Festival is coming up, are you coming?

 

Ms. Chow
係啊，join 我哋嘅咧。廿二蚊都買埋告白（廣告）。
Yes, join us. Twenty-two dollars even covers the advertising.

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Vision for cultural preservation
文化傳承的願景
Language, roots, community and values to pass on
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2.01 Learning to cook the food she could not find

 

Ms. Chow
誒，因為咧，我喺 Moose Jaw 嘅時候冇度（有）中餐食。佢嘅所謂中餐咧，就係嗰啲 Canadian Chinese food 啊。咁咧，我就…唔好咧。唯一嘅辦法咧，就係自己學整咯。
Uh, because, when I was in Moose Jaw there was no Chinese food to be had. What they called Chinese food was that Canadian Chinese food. So, I just... it wasn't good. The only way was to learn to make it myself.

 

Ms. Chow
咁我返過香港嚟嘅，咁我真係喺嗰度咧，就學咗個 course，就學煮嘢食，不過冇用晒。啊。有啲我會用嘅。咁啊因為我要整啲我老公鍾意食嘅嘢。
So I went back to Hong Kong, and while I was there I took a course, learning to cook, but I don't use all of it. Ah. Some of it I use. Because I have to make things my husband likes to eat.

 

Ms. Chow
咁就，誒，我有陣時整，譬如整豆腐花啊，盛嗰啲咧，就係俾個團體。即係我我老公有個…即係喺 Moose Jaw 度有個叫做「體育會」。咁講，應該係青年嘅，喺佢哋後生嘅時候咧，個個就青年，咁嗰時叫「青年會」。
So, uh, sometimes I'd make, say, tofu pudding, dish it up and give it to a group. My my husband had a... in Moose Jaw there was something called the "Athletic Association". Well, it should have been "youth", because when they were young, they were all youths, so back then it was called the "Youth Association".

 

Ms. Chow
個個老咗之後…即係四五十歲啦，「唔係啦，不如改咗個名啦，我哋都唔青年」，咁啊叫「體育會」。[笑]
Once they all got old... I mean in their forties and fifties, "No, let's change the name, we're not youths anymore," so it was called the "Athletic Association". [laughs]

2.02 Keeping the mother tongue

 

Ms. Chow
誒，都冇乜，都冇乜。我...我都話我唔…冇乜點隔涉啊同啲…即係我我我如果我識講嗰樣話咧，誒，我都鍾意同人傾偈嘅。啊不過我啲國語係好水皮。以前喺學校，香港嘅時候學校咧，我就學過嘅。
Uh, not really, not really. I... I'd say I don't... I don't feel that distant from them... I mean I I I, if I can speak the language, uh, I love chatting with people. But my Mandarin is really poor. I learned it before, at school, in school back in Hong Kong.

 

Ms. Chow
冇用咧，就因為你冇用，唔用咧，你可以唔見咗佢(Mandarin)嘅。即係想講起上嚟就知道自己講錯啦，好似好肉酸咁樣，唔敢講。
If you don't use it, just because you don't use it, if you don't use it, you can lose it (Mandarin). I mean when I try to speak it, I know I'm getting it wrong, it feels so embarrassing, I don't dare speak.

 

Ms. Chow
我記得啦。我我廿幾歲嚟，係咁樣，我即係我識都（淨係讀咗）廿幾年（書），嚟到呢度仲耐過喺香港。
I remember now. I I came in my twenties, that's how it was, I mean I (only studied) twenty-some years (of school), and I've been here longer than I was in Hong Kong.

 

Interviewer 訪問者
其實好好啊，係咁多年咧，
It's actually very good, after so many years,

 

Ms. Chow
誒，咁啊唔會唔記得嘅。
Uh, so you don't forget it.

 

Ms. Chow
母語啊嘛，係母語，應該…應該記得嘅。
It's your mother tongue, it's your mother tongue, you should... you should remember it.

2.03 A mother's lesson

 

Interviewer 訪問者
媽媽有冇啲嘢係啊，可能冇講出口，但係用行動教識嘅嘢，你想可能分享一下咁樣？
Is there anything your mother, maybe never put into words, but taught you through her actions, that you might like to share?

 

Ms. Chow
重要嘅一課咧，就係，誒，食到老時學到老。呢個就最緊要。食到老時學到老。係，忍一時之氣… 誒，咩話？誒…死啦，唔記得咗。咩，忍一時之氣，就風平浪靜啊。（編按：忍一時風平浪靜，退一步海闊天空。）
The important lesson, well, uh, live to old age, learn to old age. That's the most important thing. Live to old age, learn to old age. Yes, with a little forbearance... uh, what's the rest? Uh... oh dear, I've forgotten. Hmm, with a little forbearance, you will find calm and peace. (Editor's note: With a little forbearance, you will find calm and peace; take a little step back, and you will find a broader view.)

2.04 What she would leave behind

 

Interviewer 訪問者
咁有冇啲嘢係，誒，你覺得希望最唔會俾人忘記啊？[…] 你人走，係帶唔走㗎啦，但係有啲咩你想留下？
Is there anything, uh, you'd most hope people won't forget? […] you can't take it with you when you go, but is there something you want to leave behind?

 

Ms. Chow
努力咯。即係我覺得努力好緊要咯。即係，誒…
Hard work. I mean I think working hard is very important. I mean, uh...

 

Ms. Chow
即係一個…嗱，即係好似譬如我自己，我唔想講咁耐，又唔想講咁多。誒，即係好似我我丈夫係死咗都差唔多卅年。但係即係話，我話佢去咗、走咗，咁即係我都可以自己獨力去，誒，養自己嘅仔啦。咁嗰度嘅…嗰段時間咧，係好辛苦嘅。同埋一個人咧，就…即係你冇親人喺…有，喺夏威夷啊，有成就…即係太過遠嘅咧。咁啊你無助起上嚟。我覺得一個人咧，最想留低就係，一個人要，誒，努力。同埋咧，唔好，誒，即係覺得「我做…唔到呢樣嘢，我唔做得」，即係「做唔到呢樣嘢」。
I mean a... well, I mean for example myself, I don't want to talk too long, or say too much. Uh, I mean like my my husband, he died almost thirty years ago. But I mean, I'd say he went, he left, so I could raise my own son on my own, uh. That time there... that period was very hard. And being on your own, well... I mean you have no family here... yes, in Hawaii, there was a whole... I mean too far away. You feel so helpless. I think for a person, what I most want to leave behind is, a person has to, uh, work hard. And also, don't, uh, I mean think "I can't... can't do this, I'm not able to," I mean "I can't do this."

 

Ms. Chow
誒，其實我覺得一個人咧，誒，其實可以做嘅，「馬死落地行」，
Uh, actually I think a person, uh, actually can do it, "when the horse dies, you get down and walk" (Chinese idiom, literal translation; Make the best of a bad situation),

 

Ms. Chow
你就會可以做到。如果唔係，就…咁你話「哎呀，我又咩咩」，即…即如果…如果你係埋怨咧，咁就…就做唔到。
Then you'll be able to do it. If not, then... you say "Oh no, I'm so this and that," I mean... I mean if... if you complain, then... then you can't do it.

 

Ms. Chow
係咁所以，誒，有嘅經歷咧，就係覺得做人要努力咯。誒，同埋，誒，即係對人要…要好。因為我自己都係信教嘅，所以我係，誒，即係覺得應該即係互相幫助嘅。但係人哋唔幫你，咁啊…人哋都係應份嘅，人哋做乜要幫你嘅，係咪啊？
So that's why, uh, from my experiences, I feel you have to work hard in life. Uh, and also, uh, I mean you have to be... be good to people. Because I'm religious myself, so I, uh, I mean feel we should help each other. But if others don't help you, well... it's not their duty, why should they help you, right?

 

Ms. Chow
啊，咁啊所以，誒，有一日，享受一日咯，自己。好啊，又會開心啲。唔係就，誒，即係，即係你自己個健康都冇咁好咯。就咁啦。
Ah, so that's why, uh, each day, enjoy each day, for yourself. Good, it makes you happier. Otherwise, uh, I mean, I mean your own health won't be as good. That's it.

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History of the Chinese community
薩斯卡通華人社區的經歷與歷史
Lived experience of Saskatoon and prairie Chinese life
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This elder settled in Moose Jaw in 1972 and moved to Saskatoon in 2009. Her account of prairie Chinese community life comes mostly from Moose Jaw.

 

3.01 Arriving in Moose Jaw, 1972

 

Ms. Chow
我去 Moose Jaw 嘅時候咧，就係一九七二年。
When I went to Moose Jaw, that was ’72.

 

Ms. Chow
移民到嚟，誒，即係 Moose Jaw 啦。
Immigrated here, uh, I mean to Moose Jaw.

 

Ms. Chow
咁我，誒，喺 Moose Jaw 我就冇做嘢，因為老公唔俾我做。
So I, uh, in Moose Jaw I didn't work, because my husband wouldn't let me.

 

Ms. Chow
咁我就喺度嘆世界啦，咁咪走去，誒，自己搵學校讀書，就搵嗰啲，誒，high school 嗰啲。咁，誒，讀咗一年呢個啊 grade twelve。英文啦，打字啦，誒，social studies 啦，algebra 啦，bookkeeping 咁。（嗯嗯）差唔多。因為嗰個 school 係一個 technical school 嚟嘅，呢個 high school 係屬於 technical 嘅。
So I just enjoyed life there, and then I went off, uh, and found a school to study at myself, found one of those, uh, high schools. So, uh, I did one year of grade twelve. English, typing, uh, social studies, algebra, bookkeeping. (Mm-hm) That's about it. Because that school was a technical school, that high school was a technical one.

3.02 From Central, Hong Kong, to the quiet of the Prairies

 

Ms. Chow
一樣唔慣就係好靜。嚟到好似鄉村地方咁。誒，哇，嗰啲窗又好似…你啲香港有，誒，鐵枝(Safety Metal Bars)啊盛㗎嘛。咁啊嚟到呢度哇乜都冇。咁啊行出邊好似成日可以就行得入嚟。我想瞓覺咧，我就好驚啊：「哇，有冇人夜黑有人走咗入嚟我哋度？」
One thing I couldn't get used to was how quiet it was. Coming here was like the countryside. Uh, wow, and the windows were like... in Hong Kong you have, uh, (Safety Metal Bars) everywhere, don't you. Coming here, wow, there was nothing. Walking outside, it felt like anyone could just walk in. When I wanted to sleep, I'd be so scared: "Wow, what if someone walks into our place in the middle of the night?"

 

Ms. Chow
就係咁咯。係，就呢樣嘢真係好唔習慣。係靜。你知香港咁繁榮，喺…喺中環做工，哇，一出街到處又食又玩，行公司又剩，鬼死咁好。嚟到呢度，哇，靜到…不過習慣。
That's how it was. Yes, that was the thing I really couldn't get used to. Yes, the quiet. You know how bustling Hong Kong is, at... working in Central, wow, step outside and there's food and fun everywhere, and the department stores are so... damn good. Coming here, wow, so quiet... but I got used to it.

 

Ms. Chow
即係靜咗之後又去讀下書啊，咁…咁…咁你專注於讀書、睇書，你就唔記得咗靜㗎啦，即係唔記得靜啊。
I mean once it was quiet I went off to study, so... so... so you focus on studying, reading, and you forget about the quiet, I mean you forget it's quiet.

3.03 Laundries, convenience stores and a street of restaurants in Moose Jaw

 

Interviewer 訪問者
即係所以其實你哋係，誒，即係 Moose Jaw 反而係有一個好…？即係都幾 close 嘅社區？
So in fact you were, uh, I mean Moose Jaw actually had a very...? A fairly close community?

 

Ms. Chow
係好 close 啲嘅，同嗰啲人，因為好多啲中國人啊。
Yes, quite close, with those people, because there were a lot of Chinese.

 

Ms. Chow
我我講，我哋 Moose Jaw 有啲中國人咧，好多人都係開，誒，洗衣鋪，laundry，誒，同埋就係，誒，嗰啲 convenience store。
I I'll tell you, we in Moose Jaw had some Chinese, a lot of them ran, uh, laundries, laundry, uh, and also, uh, those convenience stores.

 

Ms. Chow
誒，仲有乜嘢啊…餐館，最多就係餐館。誒，差唔多一條街，條街裡邊幾十間係唐人餐館。
Uh, what else... restaurants, mostly restaurants. Uh, about one street, on that one street there were dozens of Chinese restaurants.

3.04 A Toishanese town

 

Ms. Chow
因為台山話嘅，就係因為 Moose Jaw 大部分，ninety-nine percent 係，誒，嗰啲台山人。咁咧，就得我咧…我可以話得我一家咧係香港嚟。我最唔習慣就呢樣嘢，佢哋一聚埋嚟就講台山話。我就初初亦完全唔識聽咯。
Because of Toishanese, because most of Moose Jaw, ninety-nine percent, were, uh, Toishanese people. So, it was just me... I could say only my family was from Hong Kong. What I was least used to was this, whenever they got together they'd speak Toishanese. At first I couldn't understand it at all.

 

Interviewer 訪問者
咦，有冇學識啊而家？
Oh, have you learned it now?

 

Ms. Chow
都係唔得啊，唔得。不過識聽啲咯。即係都都都可以聽到嘅。就唔係好認真…真係知道，誒，講得咁…咁…即係識得咁準確啦。
No, I can't, I can't. But I can understand a bit. I mean I can, can, can understand it. I just can't really... really know, uh, how to say it so... so... I mean say it that accurately.

3.05 Sweet and sour pork that looked like curry

 

Ms. Chow
就嗰啲 Chinese food 咧，就好得人驚。[笑]我初初嚟到…[笑]我初初嚟到咧，咁我去讀書嘅時候，咁啊見到個鬼妹，咁咪同佢兩個，我就，誒，出去食嘢咯。咁啊，咁啊，誒，食咩咧？誒，食，誒…
That Chinese food, it was dreadful. [laughs] When I first came... [laughs] when I first came, when I was going to school, I met a white girl, and the two of us, uh, went out to eat. So, so, uh, what to eat? Uh, eat, uh...

 

Ms. Chow
啊，佢話「我帶你食唐人餐啊」。「好啊，好好，我啊，我都鍾意食唐餐嘅。」咁入到去咧，我就 order 一樣嘢，order 乜嘢咧？我話「我要食甜酸豬肉」，即係咕嚕肉啦。咁啊，咁啊，sweet and sour pork。
Ah, she said "I'll take you for Chinese food." "Great, sure, I love Chinese food." So we went in, and I ordered something, what did I order? I said "I want sweet and sour pork," you know, gu lou yuk. So, so, sweet and sour pork.

 

Ms. Chow
咁佢 order 咗咯。埋到嚟，我睇下，哇，做咩咖喱嘅？俾咖喱我食？原來佢個甜酸咧，就黃色嘅，好似啲咖喱，啲咖喱…
So she ordered it. When it came, I looked at it, wow, why is it curry? Giving me curry to eat? Turns out their sweet and sour was yellow, like curry, curry...

 

Ms. Chow
啊，咁我望下就好…我問個 waitress，我話「Are you sure this is a, you know, sweet and sour pork?」
Ah, so I looked at it and... I asked the waitress, I said "Are you sure this is a, you know, sweet and sour pork?"

 

Ms. Chow
「Yes!」佢話呢個 chop suey，咩叫 chop suey？，原來係 vegetable 嚟嘅。咁就 learn it from there。
"Yes!" She said this was chop suey, what's chop suey?, turns out it's vegetables. So I learned it from there.

3.06 Pastimes of Chinese life abroad

 

Ms. Chow
係啊，你…我相信啲外…誒，即係喺外國生活嘅唐人，係啲生活都係好單調，吓。係，即係冇乜消遣。即係冇乜消遣…消遣，我相信亦…嗱，因為我就唔係一個鍾意打麻雀嘅人。咁我相信啲唐人嘅消遣喺…即係加拿大咧，多數都係打麻雀啊，出去飲下茶啊，誒，聽下歌啊，唱下歌啊。
Yes, you... I believe the over... uh, I mean Chinese living abroad, their lives are all very simple, you know. Yes, I mean not much to do for fun. Not much to do for fun... for fun, I believe also... well, because I'm not someone who likes playing mahjong. I believe Chinese people's pastimes in... I mean in Canada, mostly it's playing mahjong, going out for dim sum, uh, listening to songs, singing songs.

 

Ms. Chow
係咁上下啦。我唔知啊，因為我咧喺 Moose Jaw 咧，至多就去人哋度唱下歌。我都有打嘅，有人教過我打麻雀嘅，不過我我都冇興趣。
More or less like that. I don't know, because when I was in Moose Jaw, at most I'd go to someone's place to sing. I've played too, someone taught me to play mahjong, but I I'm not interested.

3.07 Coming to Saskatoon, and eleven years at work

 

Ms. Chow
誒，我喺 Saskatoon 咧，可以話住咗十六年或者十七年。
Uh, I've been in Saskatoon, you could say, sixteen or seventeen years.

 

Ms. Chow
冇，冇，我去到邊度都好適應嘅。誒，係啊，我我覺得我自己幾好容易 mingle with 嗰啲 other people 啦。係咁。咁所以就我冇話唔適應嘅，我都幾…幾易，好易。
No, no, I adapt well wherever I go. Uh, yes, I think it's quite easy for me to mingle with other people. That's it. So I never had trouble adjusting, it's quite... quite easy for me, very easy.

 

Ms. Chow
咁啊落到你呢度更加冇問題啦。誒，咁我就第一件事，一落到嚟之後咧，誒，我個仔結完婚，我就即刻搵到喺 Walmart 做。
So coming down to your place here, even less of a problem. Uh, the first thing I did, right after I came down, uh, after my son got married, I right away found a job at Walmart.

 

Ms. Chow
做咗十一年。
I worked there eleven years.

 

Ms. Chow
哦，咁就冇問題，都冇問題。喺嗰度就做工啊，冇問題。誒，咁你就盡量可以有，有好多嘢唔識嘅可以真係喺嗰度學到嘅。因為點解？你同一西人傾偈，咁你好自然咧就會學咗佢哋嘅嗰啲 slang 啊，嗰啲嗰啲咁嘅嘢啦。
Oh, that was no problem, no problem at all. I just worked there, no problem. Uh, you do your best, and there's a lot you don't know that you can really learn there. Why? When you chat with Westerners, you naturally pick up their slang and those, those kinds of things.